Turbine fks up guards spectacularly...

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Aedfrith
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Turbine fks up guards spectacularly...

Post by Aedfrith » Tue Dec 17, 2013 10:23 am

https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthread ... ost7042273

"While trying to fix a problem with a single skill, the developers have managed to mess block and parry up so that when we get a parry event it will cancel all available block events and vice versa. The result is that when fighting a mob our available skills flip on and off like an over lit christmas tree."
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Obion
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Re: Turbine fks up guards spectacularly...

Post by Obion » Tue Dec 17, 2013 11:43 am

And yet I managed to tank some. You gotta be lightning fast pressing those skills :)

What I found the most annoying is the inability to keep aggro on more than one mob. I used to have lots of threat increase aoe skills that helped me out, now not so much. And a guard keeping up with damage from chimps and rk's is not going to happen. Even the mini's aoe heals do more threat building than my damage.

If the auto threat where actually working, and I where the first going in then the enemies would go after me first. But they don't, they run straight past me and chop away at some poor mini or something way back.
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Re: Turbine fks up guards spectacularly...

Post by Balthelion » Tue Dec 17, 2013 1:37 pm

So now we have no "true" tanking classes then? :mrgreen:
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Egelinath
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Re: Turbine fks up guards spectacularly...

Post by Egelinath » Tue Dec 17, 2013 2:17 pm

/rant on

This is the kind of crap that gives developers a bad name. Yes, as a developer I understand that you sometimes break things unintentionally. But really, have these guys never heard of a unit test? Have they never heard of stepping through the code after making a change to ensure everything within the environment in progressing the way you assumed it would? Have they never heard of a testing team?

Yes, if this were something that was hard to find, or something that required x number of steps to see that only 1-2% of users would be affected by, fine. I can give them that one. But this.... you don't even have to try very hard. All you had to do was play the character in a fight.

This tells me that one of two things is going on at Turbine:

1) They have no concept of Quality Control and thus no team nor resources for it.
2) They know what Quality Control means and they have a team and resources for it, but the team and/or resources are COMPLETELY INADEQUATE AND NEED TO BE SACKED.

/rant off

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Re: Turbine fks up guards spectacularly...

Post by Egelinath » Tue Dec 17, 2013 2:18 pm

On a side note, I guess this means there'll be more demand for Captain tanks. :mrgreen:

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Re: Turbine fks up guards spectacularly...

Post by Obion » Tue Dec 17, 2013 3:13 pm

As it is now I suppose cappy or champ is better at tanking than waddy's and guards.

But guards are very sturdy tank traited.
Blue traited (tank) I toss out fortification buffs so my mits hover around 80-85%, push litany skill and I'm around or above 90% mitigation.
I still have the Rohan crit defence ring, so that hovers between 40-60% depending on what buff is activated.
BPE rating is now capped at 30%. Push pledge and I have 90% block rating for 15s (slightly lower parry and evade), then the blue capstone that give 100% BPE for 15s = 30s of taking it to the face without a scratch.
Push warriors heart and I suddenly have 60k morale plus extra mits and BPE.

I also dabbed into red trait line so I get a % chance to heal 2.5% of my morale with every crit hit from block and parry responses. Whirling Retaliation and multiple mobs FTW :)

I've tested my survivability on mobs in Western Rohan, especially that small fellowship Uruk outside Brockbridge. He hardly took any morale off me but the fight lasted so long that the mobs around him re-spawned 3 times before it was over.

So the ability to take damage is above and beyond what it used to be. Just missing that less important function to hold aggro.


At the current standing for tanks. Letting the tank solo the mob(s) for 10-20s is now more important than ever. Even heals should be kept to a minimum. Unless you want to tank it yourself that is.
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Re: Turbine fks up guards spectacularly...

Post by Arc » Tue Dec 17, 2013 4:05 pm

Taken in the post-HD environment:

What is a "tank"?? :shock:

Seriously though, I think Obi is spot on. With this horrible mechanic they've created - and their continued fuckups on top of that to boot - it becomes really necessary for the "primary" (notice the lack of the word "tank") to solo everything for about a minute to have enough time to increase hostilities with ALL enemies present, while the rest of the group just sit on their asses and do absolutely nothing during that time. Which would work, since it seems even healing is redundant nowadays, given the survivability noted above.
The problem? Well, if history has proved anything in this game, it is that damage-dealers are completely incapable of holding back (or even throttling down a bit); much less do NOTHING at all for a while! In short, they can't play as part of a 'group' and just fixate on their own DPS and sod everyone else... =/

With this easy-mode dumbing down of the game they've done, this problem will only get worse and worse with the number of single-minded, inept target 'audience' moving through the game. I saw in GLFF the other day that there are ppl at lvl 95 who don't even have a clue about attributes! :?
In all honesty, I think Turbine has really shot themselves in the foot with this path they've steered the game on now. And it will not succeed; it will crash and burn. Because both sides - players AND developers - are messing everything up even further.

At this point there really is no question that there are MASSIVELY incapable people at Turbine(/WB) right now. Whether it's:
a) the actual developers/coders
b) the PA/QA team
c) the 'management' directives (Turbine and/or WB)
d) some combination thereof
e) all of the above
is unclear. What IS clear is that they need to do pretty much what Eggy said: Find the incompetent muppets and sack them!
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Egelinath
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Re: Turbine fks up guards spectacularly...

Post by Egelinath » Tue Dec 17, 2013 5:03 pm

Arc wrote:Taken in the post-HD environment:

<snip>What IS clear is that they need to do pretty much what Eggy said: Find the incompetent muppets and sack them!</snip>
Ha! This brought forth an image of Kermit the Frog getting a boot to the f*ing skull. :lol:

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Re: Turbine fks up guards spectacularly...

Post by Netham » Tue Dec 17, 2013 9:43 pm

Even with all the smashing of the dev and because of the the lineage of them (most atleast) the warden class is pretty much limbless, wardens just don't die and are still very able tanks. :D Given a skraid or a faceroll environment, yes the aggro goes all over the place, but in a raid where people do what they're asked, when they're asked and it's following a plan, I don't think I'd have too much problems and I don't think it'd require the kind of flexibility from other classes as RoI did.

I haven't yet tested the update but based on what I've had time to play, I think once I get proper tank weapons (:D) I'm good to go for raiding. :)
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Re: Turbine fks up guards spectacularly...

Post by Baz » Wed Dec 18, 2013 1:42 am

Yeah I reckon you're right Neth. From raiding with Obi the past week I see he has little difficulty tanking when folks are doing what they should.

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